Open Software Foundation

[Charles L Ditzel]

in article <3c2a41f6.13422 at apollo.uucp>, mishkin at apollo.uucp (Nathaniel Mishkin) says:
> 
> Let me state up front that the following are *my* opinions, and not those
> of Apollo Computer, for whom I happen to work:
> 
> With my simple engineer hat on, I can see how the AT&T/Sun Unix
> collaboration has (had?) a lot going for it.  Unifying Unix (especially
> the BSD and System V derivative) is clearly a desirable thing.  The problem
> is the way in which the unification was happening.  There are two aspects
> to this:  First, getting System V Release 3 (and presumably later releases)
> requires companies to sign a fairly (shall we say) "heavyweight" contract
> obliging the companies to do all sorts of things.  The set of "things"
> is not necessary stable either (i.e. they could be different and Release
Evolution is not necessarily stable....as Apollo itself has found in their
migration from Aegis to Apollo Unix (AUX) and then Domain/IX and soon 
SR10 Unix...  and apparently to now some future version of AIX from IBM.

> 4), thus making a company's long-term planning rather hard.  As a result,
How could it be harder than the above migrations?

> A second aspect to the problem with the way the unification was happening
> was that no one other than Sun or AT&T appeared to have any opportunity
> to have input into the process.  I'm not asking for votes, or committees,
> or stuff like that.  I'm just talking about AT&T saying that they'd at
> least listen to and consider ideas that didn't originate at AT&T and
> Sun.  I think they have lots of bright people, but they're not *that*
> bright and they don't have a corner on the market of good ideas.
I might understand Apollo's problems but I seem to remember that a number
the Hamilton Group dropped out and stated that they where satisfied with
AT&T "concessions".  One of those was Gould, whose President stated that
they would take AT&T up on the promise of being able to give puts to future
versions of Unix.  Others were Unisys and MIPS.  I couldn't help but notice
Silicon Graphics absence from the OSF "announcement".  Obviously there are
some groups that have not bought OSF(correct-me-if-i'm-wrong-i'm-
sure-you-will) .  Let's face it the OSF members do not have a 
sparkling history with regards to contributions to Unix.  AT&T stated they
would not open up the laboratory but would take inputs from the industry.
  
> Now admittedly, the foregoing is something of a vendor's point of view.
> But I have to believe that ultimately these things that are bad for
> vendors end up being bad for end users.  
I don't see how a licensible unified Unix is all that terrible.

> Do end users want to put the
> nature of future software into the hands of a particular set of vested
> interests?  
They have for years.  AT&T has constantly had the first versions of System
V....

> Do end users really want to see the set of computer vendors
> reduced because all but two are put at the disadvantage of getting the
> latest software at a 6-12 month lag?
Actually I don't buy this ... Apollo and IBM have both lagged badly (i would
guess at much more than a year) from the remainder of Unix industry with
regards to their Unix implementations ....
...  somehow their are other virtues with these machines ... as they still 
are in the market- place.

> (Although presumably OSF will not distribute software
> subject to the kind of "heavyweight" licenses currently associated with
> System V Release 3.)
Isn't that a presumption.  What mechanisms would prevent this?  The OSF
is interesting also because none of the members are bound to use the stuff.
  
> it's worth a shot.  I'd rather place the state of my future software
> into the hands of an organization structured along the lines of OSF than
> into the hands of for-profit companies that have already at least partially
> closed the door on outside input.
I'd rather see a Unified Unix based on the wealth of software already in
existence than on the promises of companies that have fought Unix from it's
inception.

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Naturally My Opinions Are My Own and not those of my employers.